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Mark Howie: Welcome John. Thank you very much for agreeing to this interview today.
What drew you to the subject of the holocaust and why do you think it is a relevant subject for young people in this day and age?
John Boyne: Initially, from all the reading I had done as a student of that subject; also from a good idea that I had for how to structure a novel.
But also, a desire really to write something that would be perhaps more powerful and more important that children could come to
and read and learn something from.
Mark: How has your life as a reader informed your life as a writer; and what do you see as the particular connections between
being a reader and being a writer?
John: Well, it was being a reader that made me want to be a writer in the first place.
I mean, growing up among books, growing up reading constantly which, you know, provoked those emotions in me that made me want to do the same thing,
made me want to write stories and novels that would move people and interest people and entertain people.
So, you know, I don't imagine you can really be a writer without having an absolute passion for reading.
I'm always surprised when I talk to young people who want to write, who don't read. I don't quite understand that.
But, you know, every book I read I think influences me in some way, either to try to reach for something great or to avoid something terrible.
Mark: What age did you first begin to see yourself as a writer and what were the particular circumstances of this realisation?
John: I think about 14 or 15 I started to take myself quite seriously as a writer, you know.
I'd started writing about 12 or 13 but about 14 or 15 I started reading more interesting books and tried to become a better writer, tried to write,
I suppose I tried to imitate those writers in many ways, which, you know, you do as you're starting out.
But around that time, teenage years, I just, I wrote constantly. I wrote hundreds of stories.
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Mark Howie: Did 'The boy in the striped pyjamas' require much research; and as a writer of fiction, how do you move from research to creating a
living, breathing story with characters that young people can relate to?
John Boyne: I had to do a lot of research but I had been doing that as a reader for about 15 years anyway so I was already reasonably
knowledgeable about the subject.
But then there came the decisions about things that I was going to change, things I was going to leave intact in order to serve the story.
So that was probably the most challenging part of writing.
Mark: Is there a particular example?
John: Well in real life at the camps, the house was within the fence itself.
I moved it outside so that Bruno could walk to the fence, could look through and ask the questions that the novel is based around.
Mark: In writing from the perspective of a German boy you made an interesting creative if not ethical decision.
What opportunities in terms of telling a story did this decision give you; and what sensitivities did it raise with regards to
representing the holocaust?
John: Well, I think it was an ethical decision actually because the decision I was making was not to pretend that I knew what it was like to be
within a concentration camp or to go through the experience that the Jewish people did.
Instead I was taking the point of view of somebody who knew nothing about it, who was actually incredibly naive about it and innocent about it.
And I think even though we may read about it and study it, we're still quite naive and innocent.
So the questions that we're asking are the same questions that Bruno is asking and his naivety is reflected, really, by our own.
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Mark Howie: In writing about the holocaust, Hannah Arendt has talked about 'the banality of evil'.
What do you understand this term to mean and how has it influenced the writing of the 'The boy in the striped pyjamas'?
John Boyne: I mean, well, there's a lot of evil going on in the novel but it's not presented as such, you know.
I mean, what I'm trying to do here is present the story of a family who, at the head of that family is somebody who is responsible for monstrous deeds,
but who's a loving family man, who loves his kids and we have to assume that those people did love their kids.
So, you know, you're looking at characters who we know are evil through the hindsight of history but seeing them in a very, very different way which
I think is quite interesting in a book.
It's a new way of really writing about Nazis.
'The boy was smaller than Bruno and was sitting on the ground with a forlorn expression.
He wore the same striped pyjamas that all the other people on that side of the fence wore, and a striped cloth cap on his head.
He wasn't wearing any shoes or socks and his feet were rather dirty.
On his arm he wore an armband with a star on it.
His skin was almost the colour of grey but not quite like any grey Bruno had ever seen before.
'I've been exploring,' said Bruno. 'Have you?' said the little boy. 'Yes, for almost two hours now.'
'Have you found anything?' asked the boy. 'Well I found you,' said Bruno, after a moment.'
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Mark Howie: Your book is described as a fable. What drew you to this ancient form of writing?
John Boyne: Well for the me the idea of a fable is a work of fiction with a moral at the centre, so I hoped that particularly young readers coming
to the book would search for that moral and try to decide how relevant it was not just to those times but to the times
that they're living in today as well.
But also I think the tone of voice in which I was writing the book which is a sort of a fairy-tale like tone, I thought it would be best
represented by that word.
Plus because I was making some of those changes that I talked about, I thought, you know, it's taking it one step away from reality and
putting it into a more fable-like structure.
Mark: What do you see as the enduring power of fable and what do you believe it offers to young readers today?
John: Well I think there's a history with fables and particularly with children's stories within that of kids being taken away from places
they feel comfortable, brought to a new place, finding a portal maybe into another world.
The fence here really is that portal into another world.
So what Bruno is looking across at, it seems really completely far removed from the planet that he's lived on for nine years so far.
Mark: In what ways have you stayed true to the traditional elements of fable in your story?
John: Well, I think my viewpoint now for the fable, it was really just that moral at the centre.
It wasn't to create necessarily something that couldn't have happened but, you know, to have something going on at the centre of a story and
hopefully have it, you know, have it educate children about prejudices and racism and genocides.
Mark: OK. The story you tell in 'The boy in the striped pyjamas' is built around a number of key contrasts.
Which of these would you say is most central and how have you tried to use these to engage the reader?
I suppose the experience that Bruno and Shmuel are going through is the real contrast. Other than that they are almost exactly the same.
They were born on the same day, Bruno says, 'We're like twins'.
But, you know, just by the good fortune of birth, Bruno is on the lucky side of the fence and by the bad fortune Shmuel is on the unlucky side.
So, you know, it's that fence that's dividing them and just by the nature of birth which is the contrast there.
But otherwise they're really exactly the same and I think that's what they realise as the novel progresses.
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Mark Howie: In terms of moral message, what would you want young readers to walk away with?
John Boyne: Well, I guess what I hope young readers walk away with the most is the desire to go on and read other books about it
rather than have me educate them on it.
And I don't think this book necessarily is a book to educate. It's more a book to lead you into an interest on the subject.
So I hope that they would go on and, you know, read biographies, read autobiographies and watch documentaries and learn more about those times.
So, educate themselves rather than expecting a fiction writer to educate them.
Mark: In this age of the internet and electronic and screen-based entertainment, what do you see as the particular relevance of literature to
young people; and are you optimistic or pessimistic about the future of the book?
John: Well, I'm optimistic and I think have to be optimistic because it's what I hope to do for a living for the rest of my life.
But I think as long as people write good books, you know, kids and adults are going to come to them.
You know, you come to festivals and the place is full of readers and readers want to talk to the writers.
The responsibility is on the writers, I think, to write really, really good books that make you want to go on and find another good book to read.
Mark: Well thanks very much John.
John: Thank you.
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